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Comments on: Question: How is probation period policy different to current policy? http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2008/12/10/question-how-is-probation-period-policy-different-to-current-policy/ The Visible Hand in Economics Thu, 11 Dec 2008 23:32:42 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.9.4 By: Compulsory redundancy payments « The visible hand in economics http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2008/12/10/question-how-is-probation-period-policy-different-to-current-policy/#comment-4001 Thu, 11 Dec 2008 23:32:42 +0000 http://tvhe.wordpress.com/?p=2337#comment-4001 […] If the first scenario the cost to businesses is higher, and as a result unemployment will be higher. Furthermore, if workers are more expensive to “try out” then firms will be less likely to hire workers because of “asymmetric information” – leading to a further pull back in employment (same argument that agnitio uses for the 90 day firing bill). […]

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By: Probation periods: How I see it at the moment « The visible hand in economics http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2008/12/10/question-how-is-probation-period-policy-different-to-current-policy/#comment-3990 Wed, 10 Dec 2008 01:36:58 +0000 http://tvhe.wordpress.com/?p=2337#comment-3990 […] the comments on this post I stated: When people make a contract they are agreeing (to set) down things that they […]

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By: Matt Nolan http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2008/12/10/question-how-is-probation-period-policy-different-to-current-policy/#comment-3991 Wed, 10 Dec 2008 00:42:51 +0000 http://tvhe.wordpress.com/?p=2337#comment-3991 I was just trying to explain to myself and everyone else what is probably blindingly obvious to you agnitio 😉

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By: agnitio http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2008/12/10/question-how-is-probation-period-policy-different-to-current-policy/#comment-3992 Wed, 10 Dec 2008 00:28:06 +0000 http://tvhe.wordpress.com/?p=2337#comment-3992 I should have known I was thinking of the issue using a real options framework, thanks for it explaining it better than me matt:)

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By: Matt Nolan http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2008/12/10/question-how-is-probation-period-policy-different-to-current-policy/#comment-3994 Wed, 10 Dec 2008 00:01:08 +0000 http://tvhe.wordpress.com/?p=2337#comment-3994 Well it reduces the cost of removing an employee in the face a bad realisation.

As a result, firms are likely to have a lower “trigger level” for the expected return of an employee when they initially hire someone.

The choice of employment is now more “reversible”, I think that is the key for the statement “it will increase hiring”

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By: rauparaha http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2008/12/10/question-how-is-probation-period-policy-different-to-current-policy/#comment-3993 Tue, 09 Dec 2008 23:57:14 +0000 http://tvhe.wordpress.com/?p=2337#comment-3993 Would you now hire someone that you previously wouldn’t have, either? If you have a vacancy that you need to fill then surely you’ll take the best applicant either way. Does this actually create employment?

I suppose we also need to think about our normative ideas about how much bargaining power firms have relative to individuals. If this is going to put downward pressure on wages then are we giving too much bargaining power to the employer?

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By: Matt Nolan http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2008/12/10/question-how-is-probation-period-policy-different-to-current-policy/#comment-3995 Tue, 09 Dec 2008 23:50:00 +0000 http://tvhe.wordpress.com/?p=2337#comment-3995 I think of the issue a little differently.

When people make a contract they are agreeing setting down things that they are willing to accept given bargaining power etc – but ultimately they will only accept a contract when it makes them better off.

Now if the employer really values the probation period and the employee doesn’t care it should be allowed to happen – and it can in current law. If the employer doesn’t care and the employee does, the employee will take a lower wage to avoid it – all good, and as long as the firm is over the size of 20 employees the new law is cool with that.

However, there is a signaling issue because of a market imperfection – asymmetric information. In this case, the existence of a pure probation option leads to “too many” people getting stuck in these types of contracts, compared to the socially optimal level.

As a result, legislation to decrease the usefulness of probation periods could be socially optimal – however, the magnitude of these costs is the debatable issue.

The National policy reduces these costs – so we have to make some value judgments here to figure out if it is good or not.

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By: agnitio http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2008/12/10/question-how-is-probation-period-policy-different-to-current-policy/#comment-3997 Tue, 09 Dec 2008 23:42:38 +0000 http://tvhe.wordpress.com/?p=2337#comment-3997 It’s defintely a tough issue.

The benefit I can see is that because firing someone is a less costly process now, ex ante employers will be more willing to hire people since there is less of a risk that you will hire a “lemon” and then be stuck with it.

I’m yet to think through the costs.

One thing I want to think through is in what situations you would fire someone now that you wouldn’t have previously.

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By: Matt Nolan http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2008/12/10/question-how-is-probation-period-policy-different-to-current-policy/#comment-3996 Tue, 09 Dec 2008 23:34:50 +0000 http://tvhe.wordpress.com/?p=2337#comment-3996 “Sounds like a relatively more mobile labour force to me.”

Indeed, more flexible but also more volatile.

Ultimately I do have something to write on this – but it will be more of a discussion than a prescription methinks.

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By: goonix http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2008/12/10/question-how-is-probation-period-policy-different-to-current-policy/#comment-3998 Tue, 09 Dec 2008 22:55:02 +0000 http://tvhe.wordpress.com/?p=2337#comment-3998 Sounds like a relatively more mobile labour force to me. 🙂

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