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Comments on: Missing words: ACT’s campaign against the ETS http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2010/08/17/missing-words-acts-campaign-against-the-ets/ The Visible Hand in Economics Tue, 17 Aug 2010 21:58:32 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.9.4 By: Matt Nolan http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2010/08/17/missing-words-acts-campaign-against-the-ets/#comment-27262 Tue, 17 Aug 2010 21:58:32 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=5306#comment-27262 @rauparaha

“I guess what I’m really trying to say is that we shouldn’t hate the player, we should hate the game”

I don’t care what the situation says – I hate both.

Don’t forget that, as well as being a methodological individualist, I’m a Rawlsian – so I have an idealistic view of what government should be, and I get moody when it is not like that.

As long as I’m honest, surely I’m allowed to express my feelings on occasion 😉

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By: rauparaha http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2010/08/17/missing-words-acts-campaign-against-the-ets/#comment-27230 Tue, 17 Aug 2010 13:30:58 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=5306#comment-27230 I agree with Matt: framing the issue correctly is important. But I also agree with me: if the right incentives existed for politicians to frame issues correctly then this wouldn’t be a problem.

I guess what I’m really trying to say is that we shouldn’t hate the player, we should hate the game. Politicians are known to be good at politics. Why you’d have a problem with people being excellent at responding to the incentives the political system gives them is beyond me!

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By: Matt Nolan http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2010/08/17/missing-words-acts-campaign-against-the-ets/#comment-27208 Tue, 17 Aug 2010 10:04:08 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=5306#comment-27208 @rauparaha

@Paul Walker

Both important points.

I would note that in the current context my issue stems with the framing of policy. I feel like they are misrepresenting an important trade-off, and any “mandate” on the basis of purposefully wrong information is not representing the will of the people – and so is abhorent.

I believe this is a point we can all agree on 😀

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By: Paul Walker http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2010/08/17/missing-words-acts-campaign-against-the-ets/#comment-27189 Tue, 17 Aug 2010 08:44:48 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=5306#comment-27189 “It’s becoming so populist: just representatives trying to pander to and please the people they represent. Hmmm, that didn’t sound as awful as I expected”

Populist being the right word. Policy run by how many votes in the next election will this get me, rather than, is this good policy? Politicians aren’t known for good analysis and long term thinking. Their time horizon is the next election and their analysis get little further than “what is good for me?” That did sound as awful as I expected.

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By: rauparaha http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2010/08/17/missing-words-acts-campaign-against-the-ets/#comment-27180 Tue, 17 Aug 2010 08:04:33 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=5306#comment-27180 @Matt Nolan
“Agreed, this was really the concerning element for me as well. Don’t like the way politics is going in NZ at present.”

It’s becoming so populist: just representatives trying to pander to and please the people they represent. Hmmm, that didn’t sound as awful as I expected 😉

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By: Matt Nolan http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2010/08/17/missing-words-acts-campaign-against-the-ets/#comment-27147 Tue, 17 Aug 2010 01:59:40 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=5306#comment-27147 @Eric Crampton

“I’d be shocked if full withdrawal from Kyoto weren’t ACT’s objective, in which case withdrawal from ETS isn’t crazy”

I agree 100% but …

If their goal is a withdrawal from Kyoto, that is what they should be telling the public – as long as we have Kyoto, and it seems like the government isn’t going to back away from the liability, ACT should face the ETS in that same way.

Acting like we can just say NO ETS and it will be a magical free lunch when talking to the public is dishonest, it is the sort of marketing that goes on in politics that irritates me.

“Depressing change at ACT though – a further push away from the liberal side towards the rightie side.”

Agreed, this was really the concerning element for me as well. Don’t like the way politics is going in NZ at present.

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By: Eric Crampton http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2010/08/17/missing-words-acts-campaign-against-the-ets/#comment-27146 Tue, 17 Aug 2010 01:55:51 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=5306#comment-27146 I’d be shocked if full withdrawal from Kyoto weren’t ACT’s objective, in which case withdrawal from ETS isn’t crazy. We’d accumulate deficits which would never actually be paid to anybody.

Depressing change at ACT though – a further push away from the liberal side towards the rightie side.

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