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Comments on: The Economist’s misguided lecture to macroeconomists http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2015/01/14/the-economists-misguided-lecture-to-macroeconomists/ The Visible Hand in Economics Thu, 15 Jan 2015 15:52:00 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.9.4 By: mike smitka http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2015/01/14/the-economists-misguided-lecture-to-macroeconomists/#comment-43713 Thu, 15 Jan 2015 15:52:00 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=12045#comment-43713 In reply to jamesz.

Yes, there is indeed scope for this in the old-school structural models. However, the modern DSGE models all operate at a very high level of aggregation / abstraction so it’s generally unclear what their “deep parameters” could possibly represent (or why they should be stable, since the components of the aggregates aren’t stable). Big data doesn’t help with attaching elasticities to things that can’t be defined outside the context of an abstract theoretical construct.

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By: jamesz http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2015/01/14/the-economists-misguided-lecture-to-macroeconomists/#comment-43712 Thu, 15 Jan 2015 15:39:00 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=12045#comment-43712 In reply to mike smitka.

ABM, right? Hungry for HF data, emergent behaviour, theoretical hotness, new and shiny! Forecast performance may be lagging just a shade right now but I think just means there’s ‘scope for improvement’. More seriously, I think the big data stuff is more useful for helping determine macro models’ elasticities etc than for improving forecast performance.

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By: mike smitka http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2015/01/14/the-economists-misguided-lecture-to-macroeconomists/#comment-43711 Wed, 14 Jan 2015 23:42:00 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=12045#comment-43711 So how do we get more data, and data that includes variation? Do we really believe that US data from the 1970s, before interstate banking was permitted, and international finance & international trade mattered, should be added? So 30 years of data only give us 120 quarters, no large uptick in inflation, and only a couple recessions — that variation thing. Going to OECD panel data doesn’t help much, unless you believe the US and Spain are fundamentally the same. So the idea of “big data” in macro is ludicrous — we aren’t able to measure macro variables at weekly or even monthly frequencies, nor would we care if we could.

Or should we go back to the structural models (Ray Fair’s is online for all to play with), that do use higher frequency data and do aggregate micro markets? That approach may offer more scope for “data mining” and building in bubbles and so on, but it comes at a cost: less room for theoretical pyrotechnics and algorithmic innovation. Such models thus present no scope for grad students to do clever, novel things, and get tenure….no responsible dissertation committee would allow such projects.

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By: jamesz http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2015/01/14/the-economists-misguided-lecture-to-macroeconomists/#comment-43710 Wed, 14 Jan 2015 11:00:00 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=12045#comment-43710 In reply to Feminist Optimal.

I suppose there is some hope that better data can help us to build richer, more disaggregated models and start to built out some parts where previously we’ve had to make assumptions. If we could, for instance, model price stickiness rather than assuming a process then that might improve our short-run forecasts.

The question of forecasts as a test of models is a tricky one but it is clear that we’re very bad at it right now. I don’t mean that in the ‘central prediction’ sense but rather that our confidence intervals don’t tend to represent the actual probabilities of things occurring. I’m not a forecaster and I don’t know why that is but it’s something we could hope to improve.

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By: Feminist Optimal http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2015/01/14/the-economists-misguided-lecture-to-macroeconomists/#comment-43708 Tue, 13 Jan 2015 22:56:00 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=12045#comment-43708 It’s pretty patronising to suggest that we seriously don’t already know how to get better forecasts. Of course a data-driven approach will forecast better, but that actually isn’t the performance target for macro, no matter what a misguided media would have people believe.

More precisely, there’s an important difference between micro and macro in terms of data use – and it’s the reason why data mining can work for micro but not macro. Micro uses data mining to infer the deep parameters (and uses data appropriate to that aim). Old-school empirical macro uses data under the assumption that the deep parameters are known. That’s necessary because the data available for macro is much less descriptive. With that data, the extra step of trying to estimate the deep parameters is asking way too much of standard data mining algorithms; hence the need for theoretical structure, like a DSGE framework, to help the estimation along.

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By: Feminist Optimal http://www.tvhe.co.nz/2015/01/14/the-economists-misguided-lecture-to-macroeconomists/#comment-43709 Tue, 13 Jan 2015 22:56:00 +0000 http://www.tvhe.co.nz/?p=12045#comment-43709 Also, that’s not what “puritan” means. They meant “purist”.

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